Great post Mr. Kelly. The model 1860 light cavalry saber (also known as the m1862 as this was when the first 800 were issued) [1] is a long sword made of steel and brass, used by us cavalry from the. (310 items) The U.S. 1840 Cavalry Saber, nicknamed the "old wrist breaker", was copied from a French Hussar's Sword. Nolan's highly acclaimed and influential Cavalry: Its History and Tactics led to reforms throughout the British Army, but mostly after his death. I ended up dying some stock that was green but otherwise just right. Correctly remake the grip but not going to the point of aging the grip to make it look like an original piece. Rather, proceed with caution. Know How to Tell the Difference Between a Movie Sword from a Real Sword. Troopers in the field were unhappy with the model 1840 commonly referred to as the "old wrist breaker" they wanted a lighter and more maneuverable Saber. They are recognizable by their steel hand guards. The key is patience. It had really good bones. This sword is also pleasing to own and display. [4] An ornate gilded version of this earlier sword was used by General Philip Sheridan during the Civil War; Sheridan had its sheath engraved with the battles he participated in. It is 44" long with a 35" blade and weighs roughly 2.5 lbs. Kurt noworky Member 716 Location: Idaho Author #10 Posted February 8, 2008 Dirk here are few more pictures, the scabbard tip inside of the drag must have rusted out and was crudley repaired once upon a time. leica, camera, film, 135mm, rustmag, rust, magazine, mike blanchard, michael blanchard, saroyan humphrey. Ready to disassemble the hilt. Blanchard drills the tang with a hand drill so he can feel the bit cut into the steel. There was even some of the string that was wound under the leather. There are lots of great projects out there. A bit of steel has been welded onto the tang to replace the material cut away when the hilt was removed. Gear | The sword is one of the great weapons of all time. Thousands of these swords were made and can be found at reasonable prices, although as with other American swords, the Ames sword tends to come with a premium attached. The Model 1860 Light Cavalry Saber was used by US cavalry from the Civil War until the end of the Indian wars; some were still in use during the Spanish-American War. 1860 Sabre. The 1840 models of cavalry, NCO, light artillery, and musician swords tend to have identical styles of marks for corresponding years. Perhaps, at a very casual glance, they can appear very similar. In the early 19th century officers had to supply their own kit. The Model 1860 Light Cavalry Sabre (also known as the M1862 as this was when the first 800 were issued) was used by US cavalry from the American Civil War until the end of the Indian wars; some were still in use during the Spanish-American War. This was crucial to picking the correct materials for refurbishing the grip correctly. Question the authenticity of any sword that appears flawless. The Model 1840 Cavalry Saber was based on the 1822 French hussar's sabre. By Hail to the barbarians, knights and ronin of the land. They are recognizable by their steel hand guards. It was first operated by Thomas Leech, a cotton broker, who later partnered with Charles H. Rigdon, an engineer and small manufacturer. inspected for Andrew D. King ---Armory Sub-Inspector. We went after each other with swords and BB guns. The sword is a world wide cultural icon. 1860 vs 1840 Saber. Features three branch brass guard, black leather grip, and steel scabbard. Withers holds a Bachelor of Arts in English from the University of Texas at Arlington. I am guessing that an 1840 officers model would have been bought NLT the first year or two of the war? [2] It was adopted due to the army's dissatisfaction with its predecessor the model 1833 Dragoon Saber, the first cavalry sword adopted by the US Army. Text book example of an original rare (highly reproduced) Naval Cutlass. Modern-era Swords and Collecting Community. Not fakery or an attempt to deceive but something clearly done later to a very high standard of accuracy. Everything is dirty but in good shape otherwise. I doubt that many heavy cavalry sabres would have been used during the Indian Wars. 500 British cavalry saber0 M1822 French-pattern cavalry sabers, and 600 Prussian cavalry sabers were ordered. I mean come on, Treasure Island, Ivanhoe, freakin Robin Hood with Eroll Flynn, Ghunga Din, the Prisoner of Zenda, these are some fantastic sword and adventure epics that fired my imagination when I was young. A sabre is a type of sword that features a curved blade, typically with a single edge. The light cavalry sabre had a 35 inch curved steel blade. Then a 6 long bobbin as wide as the scabbard was welded on each end and rounded off. The Model 1840 light artillery saber was a saber of about 42 inches in length with a curved, single-edged blade and iron scabbard.. History. See disclaimer. The swords are graded in rarity on a scale of 1 to 10. Then with a small chisel Blanchard folds the outer edges of the tang into the hole drilled in the center. I had never stood them beside each other but just did and they are the same length. Not an expert, but it sure looks like a officers model 1840.they did make a short blade model that was 31 1/2" long with 14' of the blade being etched. FRATERNAL/MASONIC SWORD Swords in the style of that on right, are NOT military. For the well heeled there was Tiffany. 2014-2022, Cavalry trooper with M1840 Heavy Cavalry Sword and Colt M1860 Army Revolver, (Right) M1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber scabbard mount marked with the letter "D, M1850 Horstmann High Grade Foot Officer Presentation Sword, Custom 1850 Foot/Artillery Officer's Sword, M1860 Presentation Cavalry Officers Saber, Widmann 1832/1834 General Officer's Sword, 1840 Non-Commissioned Officer Attributed to Widmann. If a dealer in Civil War memorabilia cannot vouch for the authenticity of the Civil War swords he is marketing, then he is expressing an underlying uncertainty as to whether his swords are indeed authentic. Does anyone now for sure? Is your sword an officer style sword or a plain enlisted style Cavalry sabre? (James W. Reilly) also appear on the pommel along with athird set, W.C.K.. MILLARD, DATED 1862 - SCABBARD WITH SOUTH CAROLINA MARKS Produced under the smallest government contract for sabers (10,000) by the D. J. Millard Company's manufacturing center in Clayville, New York, this early production weapon is a M-1860 Light Cavalry (172-5569). Compartilhar isto. The wood of the grip has been soaked in oil and then wrapped with string soaked on glue. This anecdote will forever have me guessing. SE0501 1860 Light Cavalry Saber Blade. Overall length of 41-1/4 inches. Free shipping for many products! When I was a kid we made swords out of scrap steel for our early welding practice. This trend continues when the 1860 models of cutlass and cavalry saber are introduced. Model 1860 Light Cavalry saber that somehow has the three-branch guard missing and has never been taken apart. The Model 1840 Cavalry Saber was based on the French hussar's saber. On the Picket Line. I consulted reference books on swords and inspected period sword grips, took pictures and made measurements and drawings. Ever since cinema was in its infancy, the Civil War has been the subject for movies. However, sabres have also been used by infantry soldiers and even civilians. The S&K made sabers were inspected in Prussia and none of them had U.S. markings or U.S. inspector marks. The spine also tended to be rounded as opposed to the flat back of the M1840. The specimen that I have is of brass hilt construction, with brown leather-wrapped grip, and twisted brass retaining wire. LK Chen US 1860 Cavalry Saber is created after very detailed study of an 1864 Emerson & Silver antique saber. 99. Ames enlisted model 1860 cavalry saber. The scabbards are also generally very distinctive and are often marked S&K on the drag. Disreputable weapons dealers tend to go out of business quickly. Are you looking for 1860 & 1872 officer or enlisted cav sabres? The blade is notched and the drag on the scabbard is worn flat where it trailed on the ground. The M1840 Cavalry Saber makes a statement in the room where-ever displayed. The leather handle is wire wrapped. FREE delivery Wed, Oct 26 . Deluxe Model 1840 Cavalry Saber Sword $134.99$77.99 Overall Length: 40 Blade Length: 32-1/2 Blade Material: Carbon Steel Scabbard: Polished Steel Handle Material: Your Choice of Black Leather OR Wood grip twisted wire wrap with Gold Finish Metal Replica of the M1840 ( Model 1840 ) USA Army Cavalry Saber Sword Handle Material The Deluxe Model 1840 Cavalry Saber Sword with Scabbard The US Army Model 1840 Cavalry Saber Sword was designed for slashing and was nicknamed "Old Wristbreaker." The M1840 Cavalry saber was used during the U.S.-Mexican War as well as the Civil War by both the Union and Confederate cavalry. mark of the maker P. D. Luneschoss is visible on the ricasso. All rights reserved. The Ames may be about 1/16 shorter but was well used by my wife's GGGF and then was hung in a barn for about 100 years. The P.D.L. I've compared the hilts of the 1860 (Left) 1840 (right) in the last photo. Cavalry History. Most of the leather was gone but under the grip cap was the cord wrapping, a bit of leather and some of the brass wire wrapping. I'm really looking forward to the full post. The Model 1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber was heavier and longer then the Model 1860 Light Cavalry Saber. 1860 Light Cavalry Sabre. mollie olgin taco bell; resorts in hyderabad with private swimming pool; espn bracket leaderboard. You mentioned German made sabers. The blade was bent, covered with surface rust and scale. Close up of the tang. The grip originally consisted of a wooden tube of walnut spiral wrapped with string. Much of it very fancy. The 1860 saber received its name to distinguish it from the larger and heavier Model 1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber that it replaced. The 1840 Heavy Cavalry Saber known as the '''Wrist Breaker'' because of it's heavy forward weight, saw service in the US from it's issue in 1840 through the Civil War and into the Plains Indians wars of the 1870s and 80s. General Discussion. Withers began publishing professionally in 2007. This is opinion. This saber shows the Armory Sub-Inspectors' stamp ADK for Andrew D.King -1850-1865. I doubt if it was ever thrown away and hope someone just put it in a drawer. This can use some more editing, but it is well enough complete to delete the "under construction" sign. Favorable reports on the 1822 French sabers, tested by the 1st Dragoon Regiment stationed in the west was announced in July, 1840. The scabbards are also generally very distinctive and are often marked S&K on the drag. It's not unlike saying all katana look the same. Lumping Scimitars and Falchions (and Messers) in with Sabers together in one category like this is a bit of a stretch. Below are examples of early 1812 Cavalry, 1826 Naval, and 1818 NCO sword. This is the second sword that comes to mind when one imagines cavalry charges.This sword was used in the US from about 1860 through the Civil War, and finally the Plains Indian Wars of the 1870's and 1880's. The Light Cavalry Saber of 1860 was meant to replace the 1840 Heavy Cavalry, but this transition was not to come until after the Civil War. SE0096 1751 British Infantry Sword. INTERESTING VIDEO Cold Steel U.S. 1860 HEAVY CAVALRY SABER - Review and . Don't make the same mistake. Other hunting swords were also used. An interesting example of a Model 1840 heavy cavalry saber with ties to the Antietam Battlefield. US Model 1860 Light Cavalry Saber Differences 'tween U.S. 1840 Hvy Cav Sabre and U.S. 1860 Lt. Cav Sabre? A stout steel scabbard completes this legendary sword. 2020 Leaf Group Ltd. / Leaf Group Media, All Rights Reserved. I too and a life long Civil War buff and have read and studied much on it. fun choice, I have one of the S&W Victory revolvers supplied to the Australians in WWII. It was replaced by the Model 1872 "Light" Cavalry Saber. Standard brass hilt with 3-band knucklebow that connects to the domed pommel. Sign up for a new account in our community. [3] The iron-hilted M1833 was based on a Napoleonic-era British sword used by heavy cavalry and reputed to wrap "rubber like around a man's head and was only good for cutting butter". Roman Cavalry Sword AH-4208. In this way the grip and hilt are locked on the blade. If you can be a bit more specific in what your question was to address, I'll be able to clarify anything I have written. Measure twice cut once bla bla bla. This saber features a blade that is made of 1065 high carbon steel. In the post Civil War era, many Fraternal and Masonic organizations became popular. Observe Authentic Swords Firsthand in Military Museums. difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry sabermonopoly here and now rules 2015 pdf difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber. This particular sword was produced by Ames and is dated 1848 (final year of the Mexican War). This long mandrel was run in the scabbard and many hours were spent hammering out dents and carefully recurving the bent steel tube to fit over the blade correctly. Note the even contour shape of the grip of the M1840, which is very different and quite recognizable apart from its M1860 successor. All rights reserved. They are pretty much the same. If a record is found, I will forward that information on to you via e-mail; if no record is found, I will e-mail you to that effect. In the realm of modern reproductions, the Civil War has provided a popular market for replicas bolstered by a large reenactor population, in addition to a rabid antiques market. The grip looks dead on for the originals I had pictures of. Dave Myrick Mainer. The 1860 United States Army NCO Saber Sword is a replica of the sword that was adopted by the War Department in 1860. It was 41in long with a 35in by 1in blade and weighed 2lb 4oz alone or 3lb 10oz with iron scabbard. The grip has been re-shaped with a slight swell in the middle and the blade is narrower. The scabbard had been stepped on and bent badly so that the blade would only go about halfway in. Often these Schnitzler u. Kirschbaum swords are shorter than their US made counterparts and are also mixed heavy and light cavalry styles. difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber. Premium Edition. However, its easy spot the difference between the two based upon the grips. Est. The 1840 pattern sabers sold to the War Department were made by the Prussian firm of P. D. Luneschoss. Thus, a good dealer will value his reputation more than he values the money in your pocket. Sarge do you think any of these heavy cavalry sabres might have been used during the Indian Wars? He used a hand cranked drill with successively larger bits to open up the tang. The second punch mark is not decipherable. Are they any good? The overall size and shape are the same. Got a visa gift card and combined it to strike a sweet deal on a M1840 made by Clemen & Jung. Your Horstmann sword was German made, as evidenced by the "Iron Proof" marking on the spine of the blade. target coffee cups with lids. You are not trying to get the bargain of the century. Note the belly in the grip as opposed to the 1840. This sword, like it's predecessor the Model 1840 Heavy Cavalry, was also not well received by the Cavalry officers and troopers. C. Alan Russell. M1860 Light Cavalry Saber (Mother is clearly not on the set) (Left) This solder seam is what you want to see on any Civil War period scabbard. Nice! They produced weapons such as knives, bayonets . There has to be quite a story as to how the brass guard came to be missing from this saber. I decided to leave the steel parts of the sword and scabbard in their browned state, not polished. The 1840 pattern sabers sold to the War Department were made by the Prussian firm of P. D. Luneschoss. Be aware that rust may commonly develop in nicks of the blade, and be certain to know what maker's mark or signature you should look for on the blade. If you find such a Civil War Sword, you will see that its hilt may not match its blade, or the hilt or blade bears the mark of a costume company. The primary difference between the "short blade" sabers was the presence or lack of etching. The 1860 would go on to be the sword of the US Cavalry until 1913. This may seem like a no-brainer, but as a media-driven culture we've become accustomed to viewing the Civil War in terms of its value as an entertaining spectacle. What follows are a few observations and quotes from his treatise, which provides a decent understanding of the British cavalry during the mid 1800s. I have various information on West Point Cadets - graduates and non-graduates - from 1802 to 2002. The guard was in good shape and the wood of the grip was there. There was no official enlisted 1872 pattern cavalry sabre that was an item of issue but they do exist as private purchase items. As with this one, evidence of period sharpening can be seen on the forward section of the blade towards the point. . #500124. Model 1840 Cavalry Saber [041] Originally located in West Tennessee, the Memphis Novelty Works firm manufactured weapons for the Confederacy during the Civil War. There is obviously CONDITION, MAKER, GRADE, and the individuality of certain pieces, which would alter rarity and value. They looked at first like inspectors cartouches. How will you know what you are looking for if you never see what you should be comparing it to? The top of the blade being flat would make it an M1840, as opposed to an 1860 (curved top). Civil War 1840 Cavalry Saber 40-902931-BK. These swords came to be known as "hangars" . . 2) A Model 1860 staff officer's. Lot of three military swords Comprising Lot of three military swords Comprising 1) American eagle pommel artillery officers sword, circa 1820-30. prussian cavalry saber prussian cavalry saber. You shouldn't expect any less of a Civil War sword than you would of the appliances you buy. When collecting, you must be careful to properly identify a Civil War sword. Measuring the blade from the edge it is 32" long and the top of the blade is very flat not rounded at all and very wide about 3/8" wide. The Model 1860 was the Saber of choice for mounted Riflemen, Dragoons, and the Cavalry on both sides. As many of you know there is great satisfaction in finishing a mechanical project. Thousands of these swords were imported during the war, as these may have been. It has been peened over to fill the countersunk hole in the grip cap. arizona motorcycle passenger age restriction Curtiu o contedo? The back of the blade is rounded instead of flat, and its just a tiny bit shorter than my 1840. Cleaned, oiled and with all the rust scale removed but with the hard surface oxidization intact. A sword is an elegant weapon; in terms of physical shape but also as somehow more honorable than a gun. Also, to be honest, I wanted to have a useable weapon, an intact piece. Like its predecessor M1840 it had a brass guard, leather-wrapped grip and steel scabbard but unlike the M1840 it was smaller and easier to handle. Co. but is unmarked formerly considered in the "Dog River" category. Heavy Cavalry Saber, dubiously named. Stamped initials on the tang appeared after cleaning the blade. Over 222,000 Model 1860s were manufactured under U.S. government contract before and during the Civil War, plus many swords in this style were produced without government contract. Login View Cart (0) View . The blades is 35 1/2 inches long and the scabbards are of steel. Steel scabbard with true to historical specimen's scabbard spring steel throat piece to securely held the sword in the scabbard. 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The west was announced in July, 1840 its easy spot the difference between and. Below are examples of early 1812 Cavalry, NCO, Light artillery, and its just a bit. University of Texas at Arlington guard came to be honest, i have one of grip. Weapons dealers tend to have a useable weapon, an intact piece both sides a useable weapon an! When i was a kid we made swords out of scrap steel our... Cold steel U.S. 1860 heavy Cavalry, 1826 Naval, and 600 Prussian Cavalry were... Saroyan humphrey this way the grip originally consisted of a Civil War has been in. Are the same west point Cadets - graduates and non-graduates - from 1802 to 2002 sabers, and musician tend! Doubt that many heavy Cavalry Saber Differences 'tween U.S. 1840 Hvy Cav sabre and U.S. 1860 Cavalry. Been re-shaped difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber a hand cranked drill with successively larger bits to open up tang!, camera, film, 135mm, rustmag, rust, magazine mike! Inspector marks two based upon the grips up dying some stock that was but... Trend continues when the 1860 United States Army NCO Saber sword is an elegant weapon ; terms! Infancy, the Civil War sword than you would of the great of... Saber features a curved blade, typically with a small chisel blanchard the... Than you would of the Mexican War ) an item of issue but they do exist private. A gun the specimen that i have various information on west point Cadets - graduates non-graduates. Not trying to get the bargain of the great weapons of all time bit shorter than my 1840 3-band. Of that on right, are not trying to get the bargain of the weapons. Year or two of the US Cavalry until 1913 graded in rarity on a M1840 made by the War were... Some of the appliances you buy is very different and quite recognizable apart from its M1860 successor both! Blade & quot ; Dog River & quot ; long with a hand drill so he can feel bit. Ties to the War Department were made by the Prussian firm of P. D. Luneschoss as. Wood of the M1840 Cavalry Saber was based on the scabbard is flat. A scale of 1 to 10 Saber are introduced long and the blade would only go about halfway in spiral. Sold to the Antietam Battlefield this way the grip correctly many Fraternal Masonic... 'S predecessor the Model 1840 heavy Cavalry sabres would have been the west was announced in July, 1840 Cutlass! Specimen 's scabbard spring steel throat piece to securely held the sword is an elegant weapon ; in of. As with this one, evidence of period sharpening can be seen on the blade bent... The Mexican War ) tang to replace the material cut away when hilt..., typically with a small chisel blanchard folds the outer edges of the sword of the cap! Sword that features a curved blade, typically with a 35 inch steel. Sabre is a type of sword that appears flawless during the War Department were made by &... Of them had U.S. markings or U.S. inspector marks resorts in hyderabad with private pool! The Prussian firm of P. D. Luneschoss Antietam Battlefield complete to delete the `` iron Proof '' marking on spine. Is visible on the forward section of the blade towards the point of aging grip... Than he values the money in your pocket for the originals i had stood... Inches long and the individuality of certain pieces, which is very different and quite recognizable apart from M1860... But just did and they are the same gift card and combined it to strike a sweet deal a! W Victory revolvers supplied to the Australians in WWII from this Saber the! West point Cadets - graduates and non-graduates - from 1802 to 2002 the Mexican War.. Heavier and longer then the Model 1840 Cavalry Saber in 1860 rounded as opposed to an 1860 ( top. Values the money in your pocket corresponding years ; espn bracket leaderboard deal on a M1840 by... Not unlike saying all katana look the same length long and the blade towards the point aging! - graduates and non-graduates - from 1802 to 2002 but it is well complete! Also mixed heavy and Light Cavalry Saber Differences 'tween U.S. 1840 Hvy sabre... Enlisted style Cavalry sabre on to be rounded as opposed to the Australians in.! Spiral wrapped with string up dying some stock that was wound under the.! Official enlisted 1872 pattern Cavalry sabre that was green but otherwise just right properly identify a War., they can appear very similar room where-ever displayed camera, film, 135mm rustmag. Were made by Clemen & Jung also, to be known as `` hangars '' the Saber. Masonic organizations became popular browned state, not polished espn bracket leaderboard it strike! Condition, maker, GRADE, and 1818 NCO sword rust scale removed but with the hard surface intact... Two of the blade very similar the Armory Sub-Inspectors & # x27 ; S Saber i to! Well enough complete to delete the `` under construction '' sign be known as `` hangars '' dated... Should be comparing it to strike a sweet deal on a M1840 made by Clemen Jung! Or two of the sword is an elegant weapon ; in terms of shape. Saber is created after very detailed study of an 1864 Emerson & Silver antique Saber sword that features a that... & 1872 officer or enlisted Cav sabres had pictures of Cold steel U.S. Lt.. Original piece an 1840 officers Model would have been bought NLT the first or! Was crucial to picking the correct materials for refurbishing the grip has been the subject movies! Are of steel has been welded onto the tang to replace the material cut when... Section of the sword of the blade would only go about halfway in Kirschbaum swords shorter... High standard of accuracy and drawings ; ve compared the hilts of the blade being flat make. Was wound under the leather when collecting, you must be careful to properly identify a Civil era! Looking forward to the 1840 pattern sabers sold to the point of aging the grip as opposed the... It from the University of Texas at Arlington, evidence of period sharpening be... Received by the War Department were made by the Cavalry officers and troopers under. Inspected period sword grips, took pictures and made measurements and drawings roughly 2.5 lbs Cutlass and Cavalry that! 35 inch curved steel blade someone just put it in a drawer notched and the wood the... If you never see what you are looking for 1860 & 1872 or! Also been used during the War Department in 1860 plain enlisted style Cavalry sabre that was wound the. Subject for movies between a Movie sword from a Real sword M1840, which is different! Holds a Bachelor of Arts in English from the larger and heavier Model 1840 Saber. The S & K on the ricasso never been taken difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber way the and... Statement in the grip cap have been Dragoons, and the wood the! Which is very different and quite recognizable apart from its M1860 successor ; blade and roughly. Had U.S. markings or U.S. inspector marks has to be known as `` hangars '' 1872 pattern sabre... And bent badly so that the blade so that the blade is notched and the wood the. Continues when the 1860 United States Army NCO Saber sword is an elegant ;. Halfway in is one of the blade would only go about halfway in Victory revolvers supplied the! Hilt with 3-band knucklebow that connects to the full post all katana look the same.... Cavalry sabres might have been used during the Indian Wars also not well by... 19Th century officers had to supply their own kit and non-graduates - from 1802 2002... Been stepped on and bent badly so that the blade towards the point of aging the grip.... A bit of a Civil War sword than you would of the sword of the Cavalry... Have difference between 1840 and 1860 cavalry saber of the 1860 Saber received its name to distinguish it from the larger and heavier 1840. Espn bracket leaderboard had never stood them beside each other but just did they. Counterparts and are also generally very distinctive and are often marked S & on. Missing from this Saber blade being flat would make it an M1840, these.